FTB offline until further notice

[DaedalusAlpha]

Yes good work all around to the admin team!

It feels like, with the knowledge we've acquired, if we ever start a new version of FTB, we should have spawn a bit more spread out
I think the general idea to have a specific area that is kept and the rest that can be cleared out is good, but in the case of FTB you probably want to make sure each slot in spawn is so spread out that you don't load the chunks of anyone else while being in your personal area.

This would also help in determining where a problem originates if one appears.

If I understand correctly the server always sends out 144 chunks to the clients, which should be a 12 by 12 chunk area with you in the middle. So all you have to do is make sure there are at least 6 chunks between all claim borders. A good place to put parks or railways or other public areas that do not contain machinery.

Another thing to consider (if we get a new FTB server) is to encourage people to use RedPower pipes instead of buildcraft pipes. But this requires that RedPower is actually added to FTB.

[Obsi]

Yes, in hindsight the city idea was not a good one.

The idea was that with our other servers people tended to spread out and there wasn't much interaction between players, you never actually saw other people on the server unless you teleported to each other, which people did very rarely. So we felt if we could keep people close, people would go visiting and interact more - we'd have a more "Community" type feel. Which I think worked well. Until we discovered the joy that is linkbooks where walking around the city isn't really needed much any more, so people don't need to be close for that aspect.

We never anticipated there would be so much drain on the server, so the close-quarters living has made the lag a huge problem. It looks cool, but it's not very practical for a server like this.

[DaedalusAlpha]

Originally Posted by Obsi

I went around turning off some of these machines to try and reduce the lag. Where I was unable to locate a lever/torch that powered an engine, I have removed the engine and placed it in a chest next to where it was.

The question is if this is always a good idea. It kind of depends on how a base is set up. If you have a quarry or a harvester or something that is running and producing a high amount of items then sure, it's a good idea to turn it off.

But in other cases it might hurt more than it helps.
For example we don't know how much processing power an idling redstone engine really does use. Turning it off MIGHT improve the server performance somewhat, but what if this particular engine was hooked up to pump overflow items from a chest into a void pipe? By stopping the engine the chest might start overflowing instead as there might always be the occasional passive block generation (from a cactus farm for example) that flows into the chest. Similarly if you have a setup with recyclers eating up excess items, if you stop those the items might start overflowing instead.

Personally I think (and I have nothing more than my own observations to back this up with) that this is how different things affect the server, from least to most:
1. Running but idle engines (like pumping from an empty chest).
2. Active machines (macerators, ovens)
3. Machines (macerators, generators, batboxes, engines) turning on and off, redstone switching state
4. Machines that affect the world (fillers, quarries, harvesters), cattle, growing trees, moving pistons
5. Piping systems and dropped items.

And with piping systems I don't mean the pipes themselves, but items flowing through them as I have a gnawing suspicion each item constantly syncs its position with the server. The occasional item flowing through is not a big deal, but when you have constant movement of oodles of items it WILL slow down.

It should also be reasonably easy to reduce the effect pipes have on the server by always trying to pump stacks of items instead of one by one, and also by using gold pipes to speed up the items so they spend as short time as possible in the pipe. And of course to have the pipes as short as possible (although this is not always that easy). Having teleport pipes would also help.

[DaedalusAlpha]

Originally Posted by Obsi

The idea was that with our other servers people tended to spread out and there wasn't much interaction between players, you never actually saw other people on the server unless you teleported to each other, which people did very rarely. So we felt if we could keep people close, people would go visiting and interact more - we'd have a more "Community" type feel. Which I think worked well. Until we discovered the joy that is linkbooks where walking around the city isn't really needed much any more, so people don't need to be close for that aspect..

Yeah I think this was a great idea. The FTB server is the first one where I've actually seen some people from time to time

There was really no way of knowing this would happen, so given the available information it was the right thing to do.

And as I said, I think we should still be able to keep this community feeling, we just need to space the lots out a bit more to provide a technology free "no mans land" between them.

[Warmonger]

So if things are functional again, maybe we should start a discussion about doing an initial reset of the areas outside of Spawn City, and then letting people move outwards? More permanent housing outside of spawn is more likely if we know that we won't have to move back and forth.

[DaedalusAlpha]

I think the damage is already done. Those with the most complicated bases are unlikely to be willing to move at all, but they are the ones that would need to do it the most.

In the end I think a complete reset of the FTB server will be the solution, and possibly removing buildcraft from the mods entirely, as long as RedPower exists to replace it.

Here is a thread about peoples experience with buildcraft on servers: http://forums.technicpack.net/thread...y-cause.17691/

[Warmonger]

Well, perhaps then a discussion about a complete restart? This was after all only a test environment. Some things to note if we were to discuss that: 1.4.2 Beta A, is not going to be updated, so abandoning that modpack might be a good idea. DireWolf20 and Mindcrack both include Redpower, which can replace the pipe portion of buildcraft. Direwolf20 however also has compact solar arrays, which rumor has it also reduces lag, as large amounts of normal solar panels, each generating EU per tick adds up an invisible amount of cpu time. (I currently have 35 solar panels installed, each processing EU up to 20 times per second. Multiply those to get 700 calculations in a second.)

Other possibilites I could suggest:
1. If possible, make an explosion proof nuclear reactor in spawn, and create a city wide power grid that we can tap into, and then have a "buyback" program on power generators.
2. Create a team of City Engineers, that go around and help people optimize their layouts, installing master switches, making sure that there are measures in place to prevent pipe overflow, etc etc.
3. See about adding Redpower 2 to the server, help everyone convert pipes etc, and then disable BC pipes.

[DaedalusAlpha]

Mindcrack does not include Mystcraft and I seem to remember neither did DireWolf20. While Mystcraft has its own risk with creating new worlds and so on, the teleport books were VERY useful, especially since we got the linking table. But I think I could live without it as long as I had teleport capability in some way for items from a remote quarry (via an ender chest for example).

As for the list:
1. Already exists as far as I know, I haven't connected to it though (fun fact; my base runs perfectly fine on only 3 normal solar panels + some lava).
2. That is a good idea
3. That is also a good idea. It's both lighter the server load and less likely to be misused by inexperienced builders.

[Warmonger]

Correct, had to look at the list again and Mindcrack does NOT have MystCraft, but Direwolf20 does.
1. I think the power grid still needs expanding.
3. One problem.... redpower adds tons of new ores and features. Not so easy to add into our existing world.

[DaedalusAlpha]

Originally Posted by Warmonger

Correct, had to look at the list again and Mindcrack does NOT have MystCraft, but Direwolf20 does.
1. I think the power grid still needs expanding.
3. One problem.... redpower adds tons of new ores and features. Not so easy to add into our existing world.

You could do a reset of the region outside of spawn, that way the new ores would be added at least there

Edit: Another thing we could do is to create a "dormitory" of sorts somewhere in the vicinity of spawn but away from all major constructions. Everyone can then sleep there once to set it to their spawn point in case of death. Also a good place to log out at, and teleport to. A chunk loader could be placed there as well so you don't have to load the chunks either.