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Old 18th April 2012, 10:26 PM   #1 (permalink)
Dangerous - Post: 694

Post Firefall beta testers. Red 5 wants us testing PvP

Just like the title says.

Originally Posted by Grummz (CEO/CCO @ Red 5)

We can see from all the data over the past weeks that well...people just aren't PvPing much anymore.

You've all given us lots of reason why, and Red 5 is a company that likes to listen to its customers. So, its time to show you how we do that.

So, over the next month or so, PvP is gong to get a lot of love. Matchmaking is going to get a lot of love, and balance is going to get a lot of love. All based on your feedback.

One of the first things we are doing is adding comprehensive metrics to the beta. We started this last week. We already know where you die and what maps are your favorite, but we need to know a lot more. We need to know how many try PvP only once, and never try again. We need to know what the matchmaker is actually doing to match players. The metrics we are creating will tell us that.

Content is going to take a back seat, esp PvE content, while we do this. We believe that a strong PvP eSports foundation for a shooter is the most important thing we can do before adding lots of PvE content...and we do have a lot of that planned, trust me.

So, I'm just letting you know where the focus will be.

So now I have to ask you for the tough part. I have to ask you to be TESTERS. We need you play PvP, and lots of it. We need the numbers to test our matchmaker, and to give us feedback on our weekly changes. Mostly, we need you to bear the pain of mismatches and imbalances while we do this, so that we can get enough data to make these changes meaningfully. So please, PLAY PVP. Ignore PvE for now. Get as many matches as you can get going. It's important, and we promise you will see a host of improvements in PvP. That is our commitment for your commitment to TEST for Firefall, to make it all it can be.

Thanks in advance. < link might not work if you don't have beta access.

I think our Australian feedback is going to be a lot like "can't play PvE well enough for it to be fun with a 300ms ping" but what they hey, we should give it a shot anyway. That's what they gave us the keys for. And if enough of us are complaining about unplayable international pings, maybe, just maybe, we'll get an oceanic server.

Last edited by Noises; 18th April 2012 at 10:30 PM.
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Old 20th April 2012, 01:07 AM   #2 (permalink)
Dangerous - Post: 571
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Yep I've been trying to get a number of matches in since he posted that. And then last night's patch seems to have helped with the matchmaking a bit. My first 2 or 3 matches were pretty evenly matched. My 4th one I ended up against someone I know is pretty good and our team was severely outmatched so I think maybe the matchmaking failed a bit that time.

All in all I think there were some improvements though. I'm also glad they made it so the queue all gets you into matches much quicker. Seems like it's actually putting people in a pool and filling matches from that pool instead of picking a map and waiting for that queue to fill up. That's something I suggested a number of times so I'm just going to go ahead and take full credit for that... teeheehee.
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Old 24th April 2012, 09:56 AM   #3 (permalink)
Dangerous - Post: 694


I've yet to have a PvP game I've enjoyed and come away from thinking "good game." And I'm getting a little too polarised on the forums in favour of PvE which is drawing flak from a small cadre of hardcore PvP players, which in turn increases my dislike for PvP. Thankfully for me it will be like guildwars in that PvP will be completely irrelevant to PvE. Unfortunately for PvP players who have to level up and grind for gear, the reverse is not true.

lol < me having the last laugh.
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Old 24th April 2012, 10:35 AM   #4 (permalink)
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How much extra oomph can good gear get ya in PvP?
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Old 24th April 2012, 06:39 PM   #5 (permalink)
Dangerous - Post: 694


Loads. Weapons have level reqs, so to start with if you want to use a level 15 gun, you have to reach level 15 first (which you can do in PvP) but to actually get the gun itself, you need the print and the resources to craft it, which you only get in PvE. Power differences are huge, for example, Lvl 1 recon (sniper) primary does around 800 points damage. level 15, fully modded, upwards of 1500. Ditto for all the other classes, armour, packs etc etc. It means the difference between two or three shotting and one shotting. Instead of pay to win it's grind to win, which I personally don't have any problem with.
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Old 30th April 2012, 12:08 PM   #6 (permalink)
Competent - Post: 261


Red5's ping compensation supposedly works up to 250ms, so we should theoretically be only feeling 50ms or so according to them.

Their match-making seems to be getting worse though. When I first started to PvP around 40% of the matches were close with the remaining 60% being a white wash to either team. During the last week I have only been in two close matches out of around 40.

Dominant tactics seem to have changed as well, I use to see lots of recons topping the point table but now it seems 90% of the matches are dominated by a dreadnaught being pocket healed by a medic.
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Old 30th April 2012, 02:13 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by OnionS View Post
... but now it seems 90% of the matches are dominated by a dreadnaught being pocket healed by a medic.
That was the standard tactic in Global Agenda as well. Hard combo to break.
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Old 2nd May 2012, 07:03 AM   #8 (permalink)
Mostly Harmless - Post: 88
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yeah the gear messes with balance. I tried my darnest to kill a recon a few lvls higher than my recon. I couldn't do it. I wasn't doing enough dmg and I caught HIM off guard. I even ran up to him with the smg and he killed me in the end.

The main thing is that we can simply pick a loadout for pvp with set gear. This would eliminate gear being a factor. Other than that, I hated the statis spawns... There are a lot of better gun games. This one doesn't add anything to the mix at all.
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Old 2nd May 2012, 06:55 PM   #9 (permalink)
Dangerous - Post: 694


PvP is unbalanced because they lump different levels in together. Level ones queue for the same matchpool as level fifteen players, People with guns that do 1600 points worth of damage per shot are matched with people doing 500. People with 700 health are up against people with almost 2000, including damage protection. And teams of individual, casual players are meeting entire pre-made teams in battle too.

Now, you can get weapons and armor drops in PvP, but even so, the general idea is that you have to be a target dummy for people who've been playing longer until such time as you have enough gear to be competitive. That's a massive disincentive for enjoy PvP people to play this game. What do they care about grinding to get the purple level three rifle? The point that matters for them is how many other games could they be playing where they don't have to grind, where the only variations are classes and skill levels.

I've got ideas on what I'd do to make PvP more balanced (give PvP players a balanced pool of equipment and abilities to build a PvP loadout from and ignore their PvE level, to start with.). I've got ideas of competitive team gametypes that would suit the style of gameplay. (Variation on capture and hold, the maps maketh the game,) What I don't have is ideas about how to get Red 5 to listen to my ideas. Not playing PvP and telling them what they could change that might make me play is all I've got.
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