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Old 14th January 2013, 03:29 PM   #31 (permalink)
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Quarry spaces can be next to each other. They just have to be dug each time in the default size. With the water rule, we don't want running water left in the quarry whilst it is digging, nor when it is finished. If you have issues with lava, you will have to get rid of it yourself, but since you have to be on-line to run the quarry, that shouldn't be an issue.
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Old 14th January 2013, 03:43 PM   #32 (permalink)
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added rules on number of quarries and signposting
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Old 14th January 2013, 07:25 PM   #33 (permalink)
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Good call on the quarries!
I know it may be limiting in some respects, but for the community an excellent way to ensure reasonable play for all.

Thanks also for the amnesty on running quarries - very fair!
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Old 14th January 2013, 08:51 PM   #34 (permalink)
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Just to clarify, the default dimensions of the quarry space are what is dug out. The orange frame is one block further out on each side (ie. 11x11). The OP has been amended to clarify this.

The "1 quarry per player" has been clarified to include any quarries placed but not running. These quarries force chunks to be loaded even though they aren't doing anything.
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Old 14th January 2013, 08:58 PM   #35 (permalink)
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Ok just to be difficult I want to put forward some issues

1. Let's say that a quarry of default size at least always keep 4 chunks loaded. Point out that I know what I'm doing and can resize the quarry to always keep 4 chunks loaded but with a size that is larger than the custom size, would this be acceptable? My reasoning is that the size shouldn't matter, only the number of chunks loaded. In worst case you might even end up loading more chunks with a badly placed default sized quarry than a well placed custom sized one. I haven't tested this myself, but apparently you should be able to display chunk boundaries on the minimap.

2. I hope you don't have to baby-sit your quarry in case it happens to dig into water? It should be enough to just check that before leaving right?

3. Again I haven't tested if this exists on our sever, but apparently railcraft has a magnifying glass item that you can craft. This is supposed to show you who has placed a block, and if this is the case the signs shouldn't strictly speaking be needed.
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Old 14th January 2013, 09:17 PM   #36 (permalink)
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The problem is that we have too many chunks loaded because too many quarries are not being well managed. This is making a known contribution to the lag in the server. Therefore, in order to try and get the lag back under control, until now we have been advising people on how to better deal with their quarries. However, that has not worked so now we are making them standing orders, where all must do quarries the same way. If lag improves, then we may relax some of the rules. We want to try and stop the server crashing, general lag and players being stuck in game when they approach certain locations. This is removing the fun from the server.

As to "baby-sitting" your quarry, no you don't have to watch it work. But the rules mean that you can't leave water streaming down into your quarry just in case it might have lava in it. It also means that you can't place your quarry somewhere that water will flow into it. If when finished, a quarry space has water flowing into it, that should be stopped. If you want a major waterfall as a feature of future buildings, please be considerate of your neighbours (ie. no new major waterfalls in the spawn city).

As to tools doing the jobs of signs, for now, do signs.

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Old 14th January 2013, 09:22 PM   #37 (permalink)
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Again I haven't tested if this exists on our sever, but apparently railcraft has a magnifying glass item that you can craft. This is supposed to show you who has placed a block, and if this is the case the signs shouldn't strictly speaking be needed.
It works for railcraft rails, machines and carts - it does not work for other machines or blocks

Asking people to put a sign on their stuff as a courtesy to others, is not asking very much.
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Old 14th January 2013, 09:28 PM   #38 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sorontar View Post
The problem is that we have too many chunks loaded because too many quarries are not being well managed. This is making a known contribution to the lag in the server. Therefore, in order to try and get the lag back under control, until now we have been advising people on how to better deal with their quarries. However, that has not worked so now we are making them standing orders, where all must do quarries the same way. If lag improves, then we may relax some of the rules. We want to try and stop the server crashing, general lag and players being stuck in game when they approach certain locations. This is removing the fun from the server.
Yeah but my general question was; given that you know what you are doing, can you have a custom sized quarry that does not load more chunks than what a worst case placed default sized quarry would load?

After all it must be the number of chunks loaded and not the size or number of quarries that is important from a server resource usage standpoint? In fact, even two quarries next to each other at half default size should use no more resources than one quarry, provided they are not active (and marginally more even if they are active).

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It works for railcraft rails, machines and carts - it does not work for other machines or blocks. Asking people to put a sign on their stuff as a courtesy to others, is not asking very much.
That being the case, I would definitely agree that a sign is in order.
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Old 14th January 2013, 09:41 PM   #39 (permalink)
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Quote:
Yeah but my general question was; given that you know what you are doing, can you have a custom sized quarry that does not load more chunks than what a worst case placed default sized quarry would load?
You can do many things in an ideal way but the problem is that players don't. We found this out long ago in other situations and its is being demonstrated with quarries. That is why sometimes, for the better of the community as a whole, we have to sometimes step in and make 'simple' rules. These rules apply to everyone in order to make things fair.

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Old 14th January 2013, 10:39 PM   #40 (permalink)
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In fact, even two quarries next to each other at half default size should use no more resources than one quarry, provided they are not active (and marginally more even if they are active).
Bit of an assumption there don't you think?
I am in no way techy or understand the server side of things at all, but to me it stands to reason that 2 x quarry must have a bigger impact than one - even if both are standard size - 2 x the mining, 2 x the stuff through pipes...2 x engines etc etc.

I'd actually ask everyone to remember that the rules are not to inhibit anyone, simply to ensure that everyone has as best an experience on our servers as they can - no one is limiting what you can quarry (or even really affect the time it takes if you consider that one mine working a 20x20 will do it no quicker that a 5x5 quarry placed four times....) just asking that it is done in a way that will not affect other players.

This is a fledgling experience for us all - most people seem to be loving it, the added complexity is a real draw card - I dont think anyone is saying that larger quarry's are out of the question, just that until we understand the cause of lag lets scale it down and see what (indeed if any) effect it has.

After all oversize quarry's are removed and we see an improvement, I am sure a quarry (such as Daed suggests) can be built and tested - until then - early days folks - and from what I know, I am pretty sure you all want to see this server persist.

Lets get it right.
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