8800 (NVIDIA) vs R600 (ATI) (Im so confused)

Discussion in 'Contact TOG' started by Alchemist023, Jan 9, 2007.

  1. Alchemist023

    Alchemist023 Getting Started

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2006
    Messages:
    65
    Likes Received:
    2
    Location:
    Mandurah
    Hey everyone,
    For past month i have been reading a great deal about windows vista as i plan to build a pc as soon as its released at the end of Janaury. My focus has been especially on directx10 and its new features.

    What i dont understand however is if there is any significant difference between the two only so called direct x 10 GPUs produced by rival companies ATI and NVIDIA. Obviously the 8800 has been out for a little while now and claims to be dx10 compliant however i have read reviews which seem to indicate that it cant utilize all of dx10 features. On the other hand the R600 is yet to be released (due when... anyone know) and i have no idea whether it will blow the 8800 out of the water for performance or just match it.

    I figured that TOG would have a good knowledge base in its members and someone may be able to clear this up for me. Basically i wanna know if i should race out and buy a 8800 or wait for the R600?

    One other thing also is when can we expect games to utilize dx10 as at vista's release i can think of any games which take advantage of its features.
     
  2. Alchemist023

    Alchemist023 Getting Started

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2006
    Messages:
    65
    Likes Received:
    2
    Location:
    Mandurah
    ok i found a article at Sudhian website which says...
    The gang over at The Inquirer report that sources are indicating AMD/ATI will be forced to re-spin the company's upcoming R600 GPU, resulting in yet another delay for the flagship graphics chipset. This must be especially painful for ATI as NVIDIA's GeForce 8800 series is enjoying its spot on top of the performance charts and does so without any other challenger. Some "preliminary" benchmarks which were leaked last week suggest some exceptional performance from the R600 GPU and seems to indicate ATI will retain the performance crown. However, with critical issues still plaguing the GPU it is hard to put any faith in the numbers until we can get our own hands on some stable silicon. Regardless, ATI fans will now likely be waiting until early March to see what new tricks the company has up their sleeves.
    The last revision of the prototype chip - upon which a certain "pre-review" is based - also suffers from problems which are serious enough to get another re-spin, sources tell me. This re-spin puts a hold on the launch for another couple of weeks, and now R600 is looking like an early March launch, probably the week before SnowBIT in Hangover. However, AMD/ATI is making severe changes to the whole line up and we can say that this launch, when it happens, will be very, very shocking for the 3D industry.
     
  3. OldnBold

    OldnBold Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2004
    Messages:
    8,126
    Likes Received:
    301
    Location:
    Canberra, Australia
    Griffey mate .. this should be in the "Laboratory Forum" .. perhaps a kind admin could move it there ;)
     
  4. Alchemist023

    Alchemist023 Getting Started

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2006
    Messages:
    65
    Likes Received:
    2
    Location:
    Mandurah
    oh i might not have access to lab forum cause im just registered with TOG but not a member (only 21 not old enough).
     
  5. OldnBold

    OldnBold Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2004
    Messages:
    8,126
    Likes Received:
    301
    Location:
    Canberra, Australia
    Ah okies. I would not race out and buy anything at the moment.

    There are limited things that have been deveoped for DX10 at the moment and because graphics cards have just been released (Nvidia) costs are high.

    Your DX9 card will run on Vista. So my advice would be to wait and see what THE ATI offering is. When ATI release their card the cost of Nvidia cards will come down. So I advise waiting and keep looking for reviews on the ATI card ;)
     
  6. Alchemist023

    Alchemist023 Getting Started

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2006
    Messages:
    65
    Likes Received:
    2
    Location:
    Mandurah
    ty i appreciate the feedback. Will the 8800 be able to play the first dx10 games which are released mid this year do u think?
     
  7. Wongdai

    Wongdai Retired DC

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2006
    Messages:
    9,416
    Likes Received:
    841
    Location:
    Perth, WA
    I hope so - I just bought one. :D
     
  8. Alchemist023

    Alchemist023 Getting Started

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2006
    Messages:
    65
    Likes Received:
    2
    Location:
    Mandurah
    i only have a crappy palit x700 and it would stuggle. So im in need of a new pc. Just not sure if i should get a 1950 or something close or spend on dx10 one and not have to worry about upgrading as soon
     
  9. Clint

    Clint Getting Started

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2006
    Messages:
    13
    Likes Received:
    0
    Depends what you can afford. I'd go for the 8800 if you're upgrading now.

    There has only been fake reports on any kind of performance for the r600 to date.

    Or be patient young padawan and wait for the r600 release if it ever happens :p
     
  10. Alchemist023

    Alchemist023 Getting Started

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2006
    Messages:
    65
    Likes Received:
    2
    Location:
    Mandurah
    My decision ...

    Ok so i have finally made my decision. I will build the following pc...


    - ASUS P5N32-E SLi M/Board – 680SLi, 1333mhz FSB, Dual channel DDR2-800, 2xPCI Express x16, SATA II RAID, Dual Gigabit LAN, 8ch Audio, ATX
    - VIEWSONIC VX2235WM, 22 inch wide screen

    http://www.viewsonic.com.au/pr/show.php?id=28
    http://www.techtree.com/India/Viewsonic_VX2235WM_22/551-76456-630.html
    http://www.pricegrabber.co.uk/rating_getprodrev.php/masterid=22114488/id_type=masterid


    - LITEON 16x DVD+/- R RW DRIVE
    - 250 GB SATA SEAGATE HARD DRIVE

    http://compreviews.about.com/od/storage/gr/Barracuda72008.htm
    - Thermaltake Armor Black

    http://www.hardcoreware.net/reviews/review-280-1.htm
    http://www.xoxide.com/thermaltake-armor-case-black.html
    - Corsair TWIN2x 2048-6400 2Gb (2x XMS2 1GB) Twin 2x PC-6400 DDR2 RAM, 2x240 pin – DIMMS
    - Microsoft windows vista home prem 32 bit DVD
    - Core 2 Duo E6700/ 2.66Ghz/$mb cache/ 1066FSB/ LGA775
    - Inno3D GF 8800Gtx 768Mb 384 bit DDR3, HDTV, Dual DVI, PCI Express x16 interface 575mhz core clock, 1800 Mhz memory clock

    http://www.pcworld.idg.com.au/index.php/taxid;2136212627;pid;2864;pt;1
    http://www.pcpro.co.uk/reviews/100173/inno3d-8800-gtx.html

    - Black floppy disk drive 1.44mb

    Can anyone see any potential problems with me machine i wanna get built. I appreciate critism. One thing i am unsure of is that i was under impression vista would be available in 32 and 64 bit versions. Is this true and if so i should go 64 bit?
     
  11. Alchemist023

    Alchemist023 Getting Started

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2006
    Messages:
    65
    Likes Received:
    2
    Location:
    Mandurah
    Also if anyone builds pc's what would be a acceptable quote for this machine.
     
  12. sperex

    sperex Laboratory Manager Captain

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2006
    Messages:
    1,912
    Likes Received:
    231
    Location:
    kings-langley.west.syd.au
    Some thoughts,
    64 bit offers a few advantages, but you're unlikely to see a real gain on a consumer level for some time yet, ditto the dual-core, (not that you have much choice these days), I know some of the new games will actually make use of it, but you'll more than likely find yourself using one core the majority of the time.

    (I'm talking real difference here, not 1-2% gen'd by a benchmark btw).

    The conroe however.... :D :D :D :D
    Those babies are nice!

    One thing, you might want to up-spec the PSU, because I can see another 8800 being dropped in there in 6 months. And maybe wait for the 8800 gx2 cards everyone's been whispering about. :)

    First-gen gear always breaks when I buy it, so I'll be waiting till June at least.

    As for games:
    http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?t=200059

    And price, hmm, I'd be expecting 3-4k. CPU, GPU, OS + Ram would probably push into 3k. But I don't follow prices unless I'm looking for gear, which I'm not...
     
  13. Alchemist023

    Alchemist023 Getting Started

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2006
    Messages:
    65
    Likes Received:
    2
    Location:
    Mandurah
    Hey sperex u know your stuff.
    My pc was quoted at 4200 built.
    Some questions?
    - Whats a alternative to the dual core im using?
    - ?Is a 8800 gx2 supposed to be between the performance of a single 8800Gtx and two 8800Gtx sli. I read that on a forum somewhere i think. When do u think it will be available.

    Will my single 8800gtx be able to play all those games in the link with maximum settings and good fps? Thats the huge question that needs answering

    In addition
    - Yep im going to spec up PSU already 450W aint going to cut it.

    A final thing AM I CRAZY doing this now. I mean dx10 will just be out if i buy now (and vista and lets face it microsoft wont make it perfect outright) and its first so called dx10 graphics card --- All with a hefty price tag. You said it also with the fact that my second core on CPU will sit idle most of time also cause what companies dont tell ya is that dual core CPU only good if programs can parallel process (rare at the moment)

    Excuse my french SHIT but i think u guys just talked me outta this new pc for 6 months. Perhaps i should just replace x700 with a 350 dollar graphics card and leave it at that (any suggestions it has to run bf2142) im running on my otherwise very decent machine (5 outta 10 a year old)
     
  14. Alchemist023

    Alchemist023 Getting Started

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2006
    Messages:
    65
    Likes Received:
    2
    Location:
    Mandurah
    What is a reasonably priced single graphic card that will get me good performance in bf2142, oblivian etc.
     
  15. sperex

    sperex Laboratory Manager Captain

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2006
    Messages:
    1,912
    Likes Received:
    231
    Location:
    kings-langley.west.syd.au
    For alternatives in the intel line, I have no idea. I tend to sit fairly firmly in the athlon camp, purely based on bang-per-buck. The Conroe cores are utter screamers, so should last you for a good 16 months.

    The dual-core isn't a bad thing, don't get me wrong, neither is 64 bit, but it's all about parralell processing and a larger address space. The gains you're likely to see will generally be small, (there's always an exception to the rule).

    Availability, probably May'ish, (there's no real way to tell), performance would probably match the results of the current gx <-> gx2 <-> gxSLI range, (so yeah, mid-way or slightly further).

    Also very hard to answer, it's effectively a first-gen dx10 card, so it's what the houses would've been using during dev. I'd be tempted to say no, but it's almost impossible to say until everything's formalised, shipped, tested and patched...

    To be completely honest, that's what I'd be doing. However, your choice is bound to your own circumstances, so I can't really tell you whether or not it's a smart move to delay or not, all I can do is tell you what I've learnt, (burnt), from throwing money at bleeding edge hardware.

    6 Months should give you real-world numbers and recommendations on hardware and bleeding-edge hardware that's above-spec for the "new" Dx10 games.

    As for the 2142 card, I guess a 7600GT or x1800GTO would suffice.

    <disclaimer>Before you do anything at all, I'd heavily recommend reading through Tom's hardware and every single benchmarking report out there, as it's quite possible that everything I've said to this point is based on one little misconception. And don't forget to carry a healthy amount of scepticism.</disclaimer> Sorry, had to say it :)
     
  16. Alchemist023

    Alchemist023 Getting Started

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2006
    Messages:
    65
    Likes Received:
    2
    Location:
    Mandurah
    Yep i have decided to leave it 3-6 months. Im going to put a 7600 graphic card in which should be compatible with my motherboard cause i have pci-e. Then i will have no problems till the new OS, dx10, graphic cards and other software/hardware is sorted in a few months.
     

Share This Page